1911 Firearm Addicts banner
1 - 20 of 20 Posts

·
Registered
Joined
·
7 Posts
Discussion Starter · #1 · (Edited)
I've got this 1967 Korth .357 Sport. It came from Germany with some very shallow flame erosion to the cylinder face, but it's confined to around just one chamber. There's also two or three tiny erosion lines around the forcing cone perimeter but it's sharp edged, flat and clean. Gun shoots (158gr) perfectly clean otherwise, I just haven't fired that one chamber yet. The barrel and all cylinder chambers are pristine and gun is in overall excellent, tight, and almost unfired condition, and it was a really good deal, but I can't help but wonder, given the supposed strength of the forgings used, some extremely hot load musta been used that one time. I also wonder if shooting regular loads will further erode it.
Regardless, l like the finish, the beauty and that crisp, python (but not as smooth) like action.
 

Attachments

·
I'm done buying guns, I'm just a bystander now
Joined
·
7,435 Posts
I was at Shot Show and at the Nighthawk booth was the son and father from Korth (all the way from Germany), very nice people, me and my friend @William Lear had a long conversation with them about their guns and the history of the company.

I bet you Nighthawk could supply you an email address and you can send them pictures for their input.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
4,420 Posts
Never, ever, seen something like that. I’m more thinking velocity loss due to the extreme gap it has developed into.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
7 Posts
Discussion Starter · #7 ·
I bet you Nighthawk could supply you an email address and you can send them pictures for their input.[/QUOTE]

Thanks for the contact info. I'm trying to find out if there's any other example of Older Korth guns with this type of damage.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
1,534 Posts
Holy Toledo! That's some burn. The only fix would be a new cylinder, or resurface the one you have, rethread the barrel back one turn and do a re-gap and re-forcing cone.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
7 Posts
Discussion Starter · #9 · (Edited)
Holy Toledo! That's some burn. The only fix would be a new cylinder, or resurface the one you have, rethread the barrel back one turn and do a re-gap and re-forcing cone.
That would be something...There's no cylinders out there for these so that's out. However, does anyone come to mind who can do the resurfacing work? Would be awesome to do a before and after.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
99 Posts
Wow! Shocked to see that, really. You certainly have a very early Sport (22xxx or 23xxx series), but I was always under the impression that there weren't any great changes made to the metallurgy from the 21xxx series forward. No published source on that, of course -- just going on comments here and there from a couple of walking Korth encyclopedias. I could be misremembering.

The total number of rounds I've put through my own assorted Korths is too low for a comparison of yours to mine (no discernible erosion) to mean anything, but I've looked over a mid-1980s Sport belonging to a friend who says he has fired several thousand magnum rounds through it over the years, and there is also no discernible erosion / flame cutting on his. The other Korth owners I know online all report the same absence of wear.

Curious to hear @Andyd's thoughts when he stops by this board again at some point.


If cost is not a major concern, I would contact the new Korth company in Lollar, Germany and inform them of your problem. I know they do some work on the Ratzeburg guns. I've never sent a gun to them for any kind of service, so I have no idea what they would charge on top of your shipping / export / import costs. @Andyd will know as much about all of this as anyone. (@zeleny as well, but he seems to be a pretty infrequent visitor here.)
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
1,534 Posts
To the OP, I'm here in Arizona, I would have to say Frank Glenn.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
7 Posts
Discussion Starter · #13 ·
So I took the gun to the local Korth dealer/master Gunsmith this morning and the guy there had never seen damage like this on a Korth cylinder, and was quite amazed that it could happen at all, with any load, to the older guns in particular. His initial opinion was that it might have been a proof load with a corrosive primer left uncleaned on the face for years, but after closer inspection he changed it to a single-event explosion with some wicked hot load. All damage being done at once. He also measured the cylinder, chambers and forcing cone for bulges or anomalies and thankfully there are none. Removed the side plate (i hadn't been able to knock it loose) and it looks like a brand new gun inside! Timing and lockup were correct. And so I Left it there for the old expensive guy to see if he can resurface it, but they don't think it's possible due to its age, uniqueness and the chance of ruining an irreplaceable and otherwise functional cylinder. so we'll see. l also contacted Korth in Germany to see about them doing it (thanks for the idea)
 

·
ISO The Very Best 1911's
Joined
·
2,042 Posts
So I took the gun to the local Korth dealer/master Gunsmith this morning and the guy there had never seen damage like this on a Korth cylinder, and was quite amazed that it could happen at all, with any load, to the older guns in particular. His initial opinion was that it might have been a proof load with a corrosive primer left uncleaned on the face for years, but after closer inspection he changed it to a single-event explosion with some wicked hot load. All damage being done at once. He also measured the cylinder, chambers and forcing cone for bulges or anomalies and thankfully there are none. Removed the side plate (i hadn't been able to knock it loose) and it looks like a brand new gun inside! Timing and lockup were correct. And so I Left it there for the old expensive guy to see if he can resurface it, but they don't think it's possible due to its age, uniqueness and the chance of ruining an irreplaceable and otherwise functional cylinder. so we'll see. l also contacted Korth in Germany to see about them doing it (thanks for the idea)
Where is this shop! Sounds like an excellent gunsmith!
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
7 Posts
Discussion Starter · #16 ·
Looks like a job for laser welding.
Hello Mr Zeleny.
I really admire your expertise on the subject, so thanks for weighing in on this. Gunsmith here told me it's impossible to resurface the cylinder or mess with anything else on it without screwing it up so just leave the damned thing alone, since it shoots fine as it is. but the laser welding thing sounds VERY interesting in my effort to actually repair the area and make it look nice again without cutting it up. Any information on who does micro laser welding would be greatly appreciated!
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
75 Posts
I am aware of severe flame cutting problems happening in Germany in the early 70s when reloaders were experimenting with some French two-based nitro powder that was distributed by RWS which produced some very, very hot loads but cannot imagine how this much damage could be confined to a single chamber. I have seen flame cutting on the forcing cone of a later Korth .357 Combat that did not affect accuracy or function and attributed it to that powder. The cylinder face however was smooth and not affected at all.

It definitely could not have happened at the Eckernfoerde proof house. Proofing ammo is 20% over CIP maximum charge and two rounds are fired. It would then have affected two chambers. The personnel at the German proof houses know their jobs and I think we can exclude that possibility.

I think it was a Monday morning production, after a lively carnival celebration ...
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
7 Posts
Discussion Starter · #18 ·
Very informative comments. I obviously came to the right place with my query. And following up on previous advice given here I've been communicating with Korth's Thomas Klapstein in Germany. He asked for pictures to show his gunsmith, but then the Dem-Panic Virus hit and I'm still waiting for an answer. Will post any update soon..
 

·
...........
Joined
·
859 Posts
Germany has started to open up more significantly as of today so hopefully you get a response soon.

Have you considered getting a new cylinder made? I don't know how expensive that would be, but it seems like it would be simpler and more historically conservative vs. modifying existing parts on the gun.

In for how this story turns out.
 
1 - 20 of 20 Posts
Top