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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
I have had issues with my S80 1990-ish Gold Cup intermittently dropping to half cock when the slide is released on an empty chamber. This is NOT a routine practice, just a safety check. It has not happened while firing. I have been told that the problem could be due to an improperly adjusted over travel screw allowing the sear to get prematurely worn. This may have happened in the past, but I believe it is properly adjusted now. I recently bought a new sear from a gun store to compare to the old one. The new sear did not come in distinguished factory packaging, but I think the company is reputable and the new sear has the hole for the sear depressor spring. Below are side by side pics. The old sear is darker than the new one. I am interested in gunsmith insights on the pictures below. Also, should I just install the new one and see how it works or do you think preparation by a gunsmith is needed?

Thanks!
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My Hoag pistols was built on a 74 gold cup. It did the same thing when I accidentally hit slide stop. Called Mr Hoag and told him what happened. After a long lecture about dropping a slide on empty chamber he suggested to get a Wilson combat light weight 3 hole trigger for a gold cup. I did and it never did it again.
 

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My Hoag pistols was built on a 74 gold cup. It did the same thing when I accidentally hit slide stop. Called Mr Hoag and told him what happened. After a long lecture about dropping a slide on empty chamber he suggested to get a Wilson combat light weight 3 hole trigger for a gold cup. I did and it never did it again.
You'd get that lecture about dropping the slide in an empty chamber from any of the old SoCal greats.
 

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Trigger bounce can cause sear to hit on half cock notch causing damaging sear edge.
No sir you would be mistaken on this.... It is the mass of the unabated forward motion and the mass of the slide smashing into the frame causing vibration throughout the pistol (very stupid thing to do actually and shows your unfamiliarity with the platform). This problem will show up sooner all things being equal on a 1911 with what all of us will say is a light, crisp trigger vs a heavy, creep infested one where the engagement surfaces are increased. :)
 

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Slamming the slide on empty is bad practice.
The fine engagement of a target trigger is subject to following as you have seen.
The old time target shooters were concerned about it happening even when loading the gun and would hold the hammer or trigger (!) back when loading the first round.

The Gold Cup hammer's half cock notch is relieved so that hammer follow won't batter the sear engagement surfaces.

I see no reason not to try the new sear. Gosh, they look rough in enlarged pictures, don't they?
Do you still have the sear depressor lever and spring?

As said, an aluminum trigger would be helpful.
 

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Discussion Starter · #13 ·
Jim w,

Thank you for looking at the pictures. Yes, I do have the depressor and spring. And yes the Sears do appear to be rough compared to custom parts.

I know that there are several 1911 gunsmiths on this board, I am still interested in your observations and comments on the pictures. Do you see evidence of wear on the original sear? Does the new sear appear to be ready to go?

Thanks to all for your thoughts in this thread. It was not my intention to start a debate on why dropping the slide on an empty chamber is an undesirable practice. I would say that most of us know that, even if there are differences of opinion on WHY it happens. I mentioned in my original post that I did not do this routinely-only as a safety check.

Thanks!
Multi-Tool
 

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Jim w,

Thank you for looking at the pictures. Yes, I do have the depressor and spring. And yes the Sears do appear to be rough compared to custom parts.

I know that there are several 1911 gunsmiths on this board, I am still interested in your observations and comments on the pictures. Do you see evidence of wear on the original sear? Does the new sear appear to be ready to go?

Thanks to all for your thoughts in this thread. It was not my intention to start a debate on why dropping the slide on an empty chamber is an undesirable practice. I would say that most of us know that, even if there are differences of opinion on WHY it happens. I mentioned in my original post that I did not do this routinely-only as a safety check.

Thanks!
Multi-Tool
Both of the sears appear fine. Add more tension to your sear spring's center leg to add more tension against the trigger to prevent your hammer from following again. This is a known issue with GCNM pistols. The massive steel trigger, often lacking enough pretravel and the drop in internal parts make hammer follow common, even with the wacky spring depressor in place.

Best solution for ANY Gold Cup style steel trigger is replacement with a lightweight aluminum trigger that is less likely to bounce and tap the disconnector when then slide slams shut.
 

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No sir you would be mistaken on this.... It is the mass of the unabated forward motion and the mass of the slide smashing into the frame causing vibration throughout the pistol (very stupid thing to do actually and shows your unfamiliarity with the platform). This problem will show up sooner all things being equal on a 1911 with what all of us will say is a light, crisp trigger vs a heavy, creep infested one where the engagement surfaces are increased. :)
I've been familiar with the platform since 1974. Jim Hoag a well respected pistlsmith told me about trigger bounce when slide falls on empty chamber. This causes the vibration you speak of. If you could read my post correctly yould realized we were talking about the same thing.
 

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It's not trigger bounce, it's allowing the hammer to beat the hell out of the sear.
1911s timing is meant to strip a round out of the magazine into the chamber. This slows the cycling
If dropped on empty chamber causes trigger bounce ie jarring of pistol casing trigger bounce to allow hammer to fall to half cocktail. We're discussing empty chamber. Your correct on loading a round slows the slide down. Jim Hoag told me you should never know your pistol does that.
 

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If dropped on empty chamber causes trigger bounce ie jarring of pistol casing trigger bounce to allow hammer to fall to half cocktail. We're discussing empty chamber. Your correct on loading a round slows the slide down. Jim Hoag told me you should never know your pistol does that.
Never had a problem with trigger bounce, and there is a simple solution. Disconnect that stuff.
 

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I've been familiar with the platform since 1974. Jim Hoag a well respected pistlsmith told me about trigger bounce when slide falls on empty chamber. This causes the vibration you speak of. If you could read my post correctly yould realized we were talking about the same thing.
I did and we are not. ;) It is not quite as simple as you outlined. I am going to leave it at that. Whenever I go into detail on things like this people get twisted up. It is not worth it.
 

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If dropped on empty chamber causes trigger bounce ie jarring of pistol casing trigger bounce to allow hammer to fall to half cocktail. We're discussing empty chamber. Your correct on loading a round slows the slide down. Jim Hoag told me you should never know your pistol does that.
If Jim actually said that, that would be the most bizarre thing I've ever heard him say. He appreciated people that understood the platform
 

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I'm sorry I ever posted in this post. We're all discussing the same thing. I guess I didn't express myself correctly.
 
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