Bedell Custom
As long as you're shooting SS, Limited or Open

 

I have never shot a Staccato, but in handling them, they don't feel like a 3K gun. That being said, I have never held an XL, only a C or P. It may be hard to explain, but what do you get from crossing that gap from 3K-5K+?

 

I shoot the STI combat master for limited USPSA, which is just a really dolled up XL, with no optic. I have size 7.5 hands so I know your pain with the release and secondary safety, but I found it trained me to have a better grip reset. I got to shoot the Alien at a match a few months ago and wasn’t impressed. It didn’t have the same feel doing double taps, and I didn’t notice a difference in sight picture reset because of the lower barrel. I have a Chiappa rhino that I used to shoot for ICF and that lower barrel location is definitely noticeable, maybe I was just expecting more. Can’t really talk about the Artemis. Hope this helps.

 

How does the Artemis compare to the XL? I'm shooting an old STI DVC Limited now and have been toying with ordering an Artemis RDS and relegating the DVC to backup. Is the difference between the two (STI/Stacatto vs Atlas) that great?

 

Is the difference between the two (STI/Stacatto vs Atlas) that great?

They’re not even in the same sport let alone same league. Atlas build quality is light years better. I’ve got a lot of rounds going back and forth comparing XL and P to Titan and Artemis. The Titan and Artemis were close, but return to zero and lack of muzzle rise was noticeably better on the Artemis. XL was better then P, but no where near the Titan. The ONLY advantage to Staccato/STI ober Atlas is price, but even then they feel like run of the mill production guns but cost way more.

 

1. The Alien becomes my Open pure race gun and a steel challenge killer.

I do not think it suitable for Open. I have not seen one with a compensator, for one thing, and don't know how well the gas retarded action would handle overloaded Major ammo.

I can't speak to the different brands of 2011 types, my Limited gun is a pre-Staccato STI Eagle and I like it just fine.
Of your list, I would lean toward the Atlas.

 

Iron Daddy,
You go down the road about 20 minutes to Palm Beach Shooting Center, and you find Derek Janowiscz. He had a company with Shay Akai called Millenium Custom. I am in the panhandle and I spoke with them recently, they said he has a new workshop and is about to start building competition guns again. I have a limited gun he built around 2010, and to this day everyone that handles it falls in love. I bought it second hand from someone who put thousands of rounds through it in Steel Challenge and USPSA. The only thing that needs updating on it is the rear sight, because the elevation spring has lost tension. Other than that it is the original build. I think it would be worth the drive to go and meet him.
Good Luck,
David West

 

I saw the new Laugo Alien at shot show 2023, the "Creator" version I think its called with a 2011 grip angle. I suppose the original is a Glock like grip angle then?

 

What about artemis vs athena?

 

In the battle of the non-compensated competition guns who will prevail??? While i am new to shooting and competitive shooting i am not one for half measures. My first handgun, purchased in October 2022 was a Nighthawk Custom Chairman. But as my obsession for the sport grew i found my way into the double stack world and my search for the ‘right’ gun began.

Now as many of you that are wiser than me already know, there are too many right guns and the right now gun often gets replaced by the newest mistress. I picked up a Staccato XL with the intention of competing USPSA with it and i fell in love. The gun is accurate, predictable, and a blast to shoot. I have put roughly 2,000 rounds through it with zero failures and lots of smiles. My groups have continued to tighten as you’d expect with familiarity and my draws more consistent. The trigger is wonderful, the wall clearly defined and the reset good (not great but good). My only gripe is that someone with little hands like me has a hard time setting onto the grip and an even harder time reaching the mag release.

But…being someone incapable of leaving well enough alone, i decided to place an order for an Atlas which by all accounts significantly ups all of the positive attributes of the XL adding it’s share of additional positives. Ordering from Atlas has been wonderful and they take the great Nighthawk customer service up a few notches with very personalized interactions and advice. I am expecting my Artemis to outperform the XL by leaps and bounds in part due to the personalized fitment including a short super light flat trigger, better grips and the slide stop thumb-rest replacement.

so… where does the Alien fit in??? Well,never the patient one, I find myself waiting for Arty’s arrival, and what do we all do when we have time on our hands?? Readreviews and watch videos of course!! As a geek I have been mesmerized by the innovations brought forth by the Alien and with thehelp of my favorite enabler (shout out to Delray Shooting Center in FL) I was able to get my hands on one.

All of this preamble leads me to these questions…

1. How do these 3 non-comped, well made pistols stack up?

2. What do they each do well?

3. Where in my rotation does each sit and what specialty do they each perform best in?

I don’t yet have answers because u have yet to shoot 2 of the3 guns but I have some preliminary guesses and I’d love to hear yours. I am planning to revisit this post with updates as I spend time with them and shoot them side by side but here are my guesses for posterities sake.

1. The Alien becomes my Open pure race gun and a steel challenge killer.
2. TheArtemis settles into a role as my primary USPSA limited optics gun.
3. The XL gets related to range toy and backup for the Artemis.

PLEASE SHARE YOUR THOUGHTS WITH ME. View attachment 1180616
View attachment 1180617
View attachment 1180615

Of these 3 the atlas. Staccato's just dont feel great quality to me. The alien doesn't really fit into any division perfectly right now.

 

If price is no issue, Atlas for sure. Look at what's being used out there among your picks. And this is sample size of one, but I took a class a couple years back with someone that had an Alien and he couldn't finish the class due to cycling issues. That said, all high-end guns may need break in but Atlas less so in my experience.

 

Biggest problem with the Alien is if you’re shooting over about 50-70 rounds, you’re going to need some gloves, maybe even thermal gloves to continue to shoot it. It gets that hot. It would be the latest shooting of them by a long shot. As far as the differnece in feel between the XL and Artemis, the XL really isn’t that far off, I’ve put Atlas triggers and thumb safeties in my Staccatos, and went to Cheely grips. The Atlas is better no doubt. But not by the huge amounts some say. And so far my XC is the latest and softest of them all, more so than the Erebus, and my go to gun most of the time. That’s comped though, so different. I understand Atlas is coming out with a fixed sighblock comped gun in a few months, which I will be ordering.

 

Biggest problem with the Alien is if you’re shooting over about 50-70 rounds, you’re going to need some gloves,

If you wanted to sponsor Team Mediocre with an Alien, it would be shot in 18 round maximum IDPA stages and 32 round maximum USPSA stages. Practice sessions in fits no longer with a pause between. I never got burnt by a P7, I think I would be ok with the Alien.

But I agree, it is pretty much a novelty item, the smart money is on 2011 and CZ/TZ. I can't pick a brand, my newest match gun is 11 years old and works just fine, thank you.

 

I love the CZ TSO2, thinking of getting a Phoenix Drake also.

 

I started with an STI and then later migrated to an Atlas. Had them both at the same time. The fit, finish, and quality is much higher with Atlas for sure and well worth the money IMO.
I even ended up modding my STI with a metal grip, trigger, etc and after all the upgrades might as well just go for the Atlas. It ended up costing a bit less for an upgraded STI/Staccato but again the Atlas is just a complete package ready to go.

Biggest thing for me is the metal grip and grip texture so any future purchase I always take that into account now.

 

I own all three (well a Titan and a Hyperion, not Artemis).

I vote Atlas over the Alien and Staccato XL.

 

My experience with Alien is hot hot hot and must run it clean. Had too many issues way too fast. When it works, it’s smoooooooth but problems arise so fast.

So I like atlas better (haven’t shot Artemis tho).

 

Hey man you should check out infinity they are God

 

So I came across someone looking to dump an alien, his wife told him it needed to go. I ran it at a steel open competition using American Eagle 150gr fmj. 28-32 plates at each stage with 8 stages. Ran without issues. I do clean it after each day at the range, so that may be why I never had problems with it. I still think my STI combat master runs nicer for USPSA, but the alien isn’t a bad gun (I just need that retro slide). The biggest complaint I would make about it, the mags have that hook on them, which caught my fingers twice (I didn’t practice enough with it). The angle the mags go in also felt awkward at first, unlike my STI.

 

I have owned both an XL and Artemis, I would choose the XL from the feel alone, no experience with the Alien

 

The alien is the flattest shooting, but gets very hot very quickly. I’d take the Atlas over the XL but the XL is very nice shooting as well

 

The Alien really doesn't have a place in USPSA.

 

In the battle of the non-compensated competition guns who will prevail??? While i am new to shooting and competitive shooting i am not one for half measures. My first handgun, purchased in October 2022 was a Nighthawk Custom Chairman. But as my obsession for the sport grew i found my way into the double stack world and my search for the ‘right’ gun began.

Now as many of you that are wiser than me already know, there are too many right guns and the right now gun often gets replaced by the newest mistress. I picked up a Staccato XL with the intention of competing USPSA with it and i fell in love. The gun is accurate, predictable, and a blast to shoot. I have put roughly 2,000 rounds through it with zero failures and lots of smiles. My groups have continued to tighten as you’d expect with familiarity and my draws more consistent. The trigger is wonderful, the wall clearly defined and the reset good (not great but good). My only gripe is that someone with little hands like me has a hard time setting onto the grip and an even harder time reaching the mag release.

But…being someone incapable of leaving well enough alone, i decided to place an order for an Atlas which by all accounts significantly ups all of the positive attributes of the XL adding it’s share of additional positives. Ordering from Atlas has been wonderful and they take the great Nighthawk customer service up a few notches with very personalized interactions and advice. I am expecting my Artemis to outperform the XL by leaps and bounds in part due to the personalized fitment including a short super light flat trigger, better grips and the slide stop thumb-rest replacement.

so… where does the Alien fit in??? Well,never the patient one, I find myself waiting for Arty’s arrival, and what do we all do when we have time on our hands?? Readreviews and watch videos of course!! As a geek I have been mesmerized by the innovations brought forth by the Alien and with thehelp of my favorite enabler (shout out to Delray Shooting Center in FL) I was able to get my hands on one.

All of this preamble leads me to these questions…

1. How do these 3 non-comped, well made pistols stack up?

2. What do they each do well?

3. Where in my rotation does each sit and what specialty do they each perform best in?

I don’t yet have answers because u have yet to shoot 2 of the3 guns but I have some preliminary guesses and I’d love to hear yours. I am planning to revisit this post with updates as I spend time with them and shoot them side by side but here are my guesses for posterities sake.

1. The Alien becomes my Open pure race gun and a steel challenge killer.
2. TheArtemis settles into a role as my primary USPSA limited optics gun.
3. The XL gets related to range toy and backup for the Artemis.

PLEASE SHARE YOUR THOUGHTS WITH ME. View attachment 1180616
View attachment 1180617
View attachment 1180615

In the battle of the non-compensated competition guns who will prevail??? While i am new to shooting and competitive shooting i am not one for half measures. My first handgun, purchased in October 2022 was a Nighthawk Custom Chairman. But as my obsession for the sport grew i found my way into the double stack world and my search for the ‘right’ gun began.

Now as many of you that are wiser than me already know, there are too many right guns and the right now gun often gets replaced by the newest mistress. I picked up a Staccato XL with the intention of competing USPSA with it and i fell in love. The gun is accurate, predictable, and a blast to shoot. I have put roughly 2,000 rounds through it with zero failures and lots of smiles. My groups have continued to tighten as you’d expect with familiarity and my draws more consistent. The trigger is wonderful, the wall clearly defined and the reset good (not great but good). My only gripe is that someone with little hands like me has a hard time setting onto the grip and an even harder time reaching the mag release.

But…being someone incapable of leaving well enough alone, i decided to place an order for an Atlas which by all accounts significantly ups all of the positive attributes of the XL adding it’s share of additional positives. Ordering from Atlas has been wonderful and they take the great Nighthawk customer service up a few notches with very personalized interactions and advice. I am expecting my Artemis to outperform the XL by leaps and bounds in part due to the personalized fitment including a short super light flat trigger, better grips and the slide stop thumb-rest replacement.

so… where does the Alien fit in??? Well,never the patient one, I find myself waiting for Arty’s arrival, and what do we all do when we have time on our hands?? Readreviews and watch videos of course!! As a geek I have been mesmerized by the innovations brought forth by the Alien and with thehelp of my favorite enabler (shout out to Delray Shooting Center in FL) I was able to get my hands on one.

All of this preamble leads me to these questions…

1. How do these 3 non-comped, well made pistols stack up?

2. What do they each do well?

3. Where in my rotation does each sit and what specialty do they each perform best in?

I don’t yet have answers because u have yet to shoot 2 of the3 guns but I have some preliminary guesses and I’d love to hear yours. I am planning to revisit this post with updates as I spend time with them and shoot them side by side but here are my guesses for posterities sake.

1. The Alien becomes my Open pure race gun and a steel challenge killer.
2. TheArtemis settles into a role as my primary USPSA limited optics gun.
3. The XL gets related to range toy and backup for the Artemis.

PLEASE SHARE YOUR THOUGHTS WITH ME. View attachment 1180616
View attachment 1180617
View attachment 1180615

Update:

I have since sold the XL and just put up for sale the amazing Artemis and ordered the Limited Optics version of the Alien, which will now make be my 3rd Alien that I own. While I loved both the XL and the Atlas, the Alien is truly a cheat code and it’s more configurable and easier to maintain. Yes it gets hot and dirty, both consequences of the gas system but the the new 22 round mags in combination with the magwell and grip angle make it a limited Optics killer

 

I think Atlas always wins. Hard to beat the quality for the price.

 

Atlas Titan for USPSA LO
Atlas Erebus for Open USPSA, and steel challenge

 

Atlas would be my choice, staccato is not the old sti their now just over priced production guns don't get me wrong their nice but their no where near atlas or some other 1911/2011 builders

 

Staccato is nowhere near Atlas and/or other custom 2011 builders prices either ($6-8k+ vs $2-4k)...its all relative

 

I own an Athena and have compared it to the shadow 2, bul armory, and the alien. I would almost put the alien last or just a little ahead of my shadow 2.
Maybe it's just the ergo's but I am much faster on target and follow up shots with the Athena and the Bul Armory. Alien just didn't work for me and for the price I could never justify it.